Hatewheel On Power Creep

NgOroo posted:

You think Exalted isn't bloated now?

Resolution: who rolls what, with what tools aiding, versus what opposition? We really got combat down pretty good, at least in theory, because RPGs came out of wargaming, but that's not the limit of the Storytelling system! You think ST can't handle it? I think we just need to figure out how. It isn't about a thousand bloated separate systems; it's about one hardcore system, and how we plug in what where and at what scale. We don't want to roll 1000 dice for 10 Exalts in a unit, so we scale them down using a system.

Plus j'adore the fabulous charmsets. But they are wayyyy too tactically-oriented. I am so very willing to sacrifice some tactical bloat for some non-tactical rules. Most charms are about how to stab people. I want to be sure I can also set two sailing ships against each other in a race without house-ruling it. I should be able to use this Storytelling mechanic to deal with complex actions beyond stabbing and shooting.

I mean, look at RotSE: it's screaming for it. So much of that wants to be not about punching people in the face. Suggestions for how to deal with team "successes" versus ED's plans: how long before the dragon lines get poisoned, etc.

Look, we have a resolution system. We have the outline, and when it comes to individuals fighting others we have a shit-ton of options. It's sexy.

But let's try to create something that includes power level Ess 2-5 without breaking. How we resolve physical combat should be a fine model for how we resolve social scenes, war scenes, taming riding beasts scenes, erotic scenes: it's about choosing the right tools. Combat uses weapons and armor. Seduction uses, say, speech skills and charms, gifts and other tricks. Defeating a trap? Your mind against the artifact: a static check but what kind of tools do you have?

I think Exalted is totally capable of being hacked to deal with all kinds of situations without ridiculous bloat. I do, I honestly do. I like the system, even though perfects are currently ruining my fun hardcore.

A tremendous post. Exalted can deal with an extravagant number of issues. I think 2e canted off course early on by putting so much tremendous focus on combat. Most of the Charms in print have something to do with physical combat. There's so much combat primacy on the systems that simulationists play a game that is quite different than narrativists. Combat supremacy can solve all your problems, and it makes social characters and non combat characters irrelevant. This is a mistake.

Hell, we don't even have a proper Bureaucracy system, and I'm pretty sure I can run a 40 yard dash just as fast as a horse in Creation. There's no granularity anywhere except for the combat system. Everything else has been left way behind, while there's so many options for combat, and such a focus on combat, and such an improbability in the relevance of characters who aren't optimized to fight, that system Creation looks almost nothing like setting Creation. This is wrong, and because of that, Exalted requires definite revision from the bottom up.

One of the things that struck me, fascinated me, absolutely wooed me about first edition was the microscopic view of Creation's culture, economy, and politics. What else got to me was the utter absence of easy magitech and the imposed/supposed rarity of artifacts and sorcery. It really felt like an Age of Sorrows. It had the thematic feel of a ruined world, which proceeds from an entirely different genre than one full of magical robots and magitechnology and an abundance of sorcery, as with the First Age, which was of course, left a total mystery. 2e Exalted does not feel like an Age of Sorrows for many reasons, including that we know exactly what the First Age looked like, and now rather than a huge absence of knowledge and magitech, our world is full of it, and we have but to reassemble it and follow a map back to the shit outlined in DotFA. This means the Age of Sorrows is an Age of restoration, and that is patently incorrect for the feel of the game, which should have been one whereby, if you are going to save Creation, you are going to do it in a world that is yet ruined, and without changing the theme of the entire game from Age of Sorrows to Age of Rediscovery. This problem is also compounded by the appearance of Autochthonia in 2e. While the Alchemicals are wonderfully imagined and wonderfully written, they got the scope all wrong and further exacerbated the setting shift. It should be possible to open the seal into Creation and launch an Autochthonian invasion and have it be a synch-point with the dark age feel of Exalted, rather than a turning point that throws the setting flavor all out of whack.

In 3e it would be important to lower the general power level, take the emphasis off combat*, make social gaming and non combat contests (such as racing and crafting) more meaningful, give non combat characters ways to opt out of combat or avoid it, and to emphasize the ruined feel of the setting, the lack of wonders, and the possibility that there is no going back, there's no recovering what was lost. (And before anyone jumps on my case, this does not mean that you can't save Creation or build a new Age, but rather that those things are not mutually dependent on one another.)

*Though the combat system needs to be bad ass. This is usually what we talk about when we discuss 3e.

Unless otherwise stated, the content of this page is licensed under Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 License